WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:24.880 So, which of those types of bilingual programming options do you have questions about? 00:00:25.880 --> 00:00:28.700 Which ones you think you were able to figure out? 00:00:28.700 --> 00:00:30.260 we'll leave those aside. 00:00:30.980 --> 00:00:32.480 But those you want to ask about 00:00:32.480 --> 00:00:36.800 or you want to test out your theory on, 00:00:37.080 --> 00:00:39.560 if you figured, if you're not sure 00:00:39.560 --> 00:00:40.880 but came up with something 00:00:40.880 --> 00:00:45.040 or one of those such as, yes? 00:00:49.380 --> 00:00:52.240 Okay, so in the group, 00:00:52.240 --> 00:00:55.420 we're still confused 00:00:55.420 --> 00:00:59.980 about the partial immersion, total immersion. 00:01:00.120 --> 00:01:01.240 What does it mean by that? 00:01:01.880 --> 00:01:04.780 Two-way immersion and double immersion. 00:01:05.200 --> 00:01:09.780 What's the difference between total, two-way, and double immersion? 00:01:11.060 --> 00:01:13.280 So maybe you can explain more about it. 00:01:14.080 --> 00:01:14.340 Okay. 00:01:14.480 --> 00:01:15.080 Thank you. 00:01:15.080 --> 00:01:18.940 Does anyone in the audience want to give it a try? 00:01:18.940 --> 00:01:27.080 Is there one of those in the audience that you feel 00:01:27.071 --> 00:01:28.791 talking about with? 00:01:31.011 --> 00:01:38.291 Because part of the problem with terms is that they try to capture it, 00:01:38.411 --> 00:01:41.631 but they don't ever quite perfectly capture it. 00:01:43.111 --> 00:01:44.251 Is somebody willing to... 00:01:44.251 --> 00:01:44.851 Oh, Kerry. 00:01:57.071 --> 00:02:09.631 This is difficult. It's confusing. I try not to think in the literal term for we do immersion and I always have to check on these. 00:02:11.511 --> 00:02:24.911 So in total immersion, in our primary group, in our kindergarten, grade one, grade two, the students come in and they're fully immersed in English, which is their second language. 00:02:24.911 --> 00:02:28.011 Carrie, could you tell us what country you're working in? 00:02:28.291 --> 00:02:28.771 Indonesia. 00:02:30.091 --> 00:02:32.111 So our teachers in Indonesia, 00:02:32.551 --> 00:02:35.031 especially our special early education teachers, 00:02:35.551 --> 00:02:36.911 they're our most... 00:02:37.611 --> 00:02:40.031 We spend an awful lot of time training them, 00:02:40.491 --> 00:02:42.311 and they'll use their language, 00:02:42.871 --> 00:02:44.371 their dual language ability, 00:02:44.751 --> 00:02:46.511 especially during total immersion. 00:02:47.551 --> 00:02:47.711 Okay? 00:02:48.191 --> 00:02:50.531 So that's just in a nutshell. 00:02:50.791 --> 00:02:52.231 That's total immersion. 00:02:52.231 --> 00:02:54.151 And we can do that... 00:02:54.142 --> 00:02:57.742 early on because they're so flexible in their language learning. 00:02:58.522 --> 00:03:01.942 Most of their mom and dads are totally Bahasa Indonesian. 00:03:02.142 --> 00:03:03.722 They're not English speakers themselves. 00:03:04.522 --> 00:03:08.482 The culture, the society is English foreign language. 00:03:08.482 --> 00:03:11.282 So the only English they hear is in our classroom. 00:03:12.162 --> 00:03:13.962 And they become rather strong. 00:03:14.742 --> 00:03:20.362 When they're about themselves, a lot of times they'll break into Bahasa. 00:03:20.782 --> 00:03:23.222 So they're developing their Bahasa at home. 00:03:23.222 --> 00:03:25.202 and their English at school. 00:03:25.742 --> 00:03:27.602 And we look at that as total immersion. 00:03:28.642 --> 00:03:31.922 Then around grade three, we start to bring kids in 00:03:31.922 --> 00:03:35.902 who are from the national program, and they have zero English. 00:03:37.802 --> 00:03:40.402 And they're at a little different age level, 00:03:40.402 --> 00:03:44.742 so we can't look at totally immersing them in English. 00:03:45.922 --> 00:03:50.822 So again, our teachers at that level are trained to use both their languages, 00:03:50.822 --> 00:03:53.822 languages, and the program is very 00:03:53.822 --> 00:03:56.322 flexible, using a lot of project 00:03:56.322 --> 00:03:58.322 based stuff, so the student has an 00:03:58.322 --> 00:04:02.462 opportunity to use their L1, but 00:04:02.462 --> 00:04:06.462 they're still partly immersed in 00:04:06.462 --> 00:04:08.882 English, so they're still in the 00:04:08.882 --> 00:04:11.182 mainstream classroom, except during 00:04:11.182 --> 00:04:13.382 project time, which all students are 00:04:13.382 --> 00:04:14.982 using whatever language they're most 00:04:14.982 --> 00:04:17.082 comfortable using. 00:04:17.082 --> 00:04:19.622 And it takes them probably about 24 00:04:19.622 --> 00:04:21.222 doing some esoteric 00:04:21.213 --> 00:04:28.073 to come up to where they're pretty good with their English as well. 00:04:28.693 --> 00:04:34.313 Then in the high school, they're coming in at a later time, 00:04:34.313 --> 00:04:38.613 and their language learning capacity is different again. 00:04:39.173 --> 00:04:41.513 So we have almost a two-way immersion. 00:04:41.973 --> 00:04:46.593 Our teachers are trained to be able to deliver their content material 00:04:46.593 --> 00:04:48.813 in, of course, the student's L1. 00:04:48.813 --> 00:04:55.813 And there's particular aspects of their program then that they're learning in English, verbs, 00:04:55.813 --> 00:05:00.573 the cognitive language that they need, the technical language. 00:05:00.573 --> 00:05:04.613 So there's different types of programs. 00:05:04.613 --> 00:05:09.873 They're all used in one school, but it really depends on where their student is in their 00:05:09.873 --> 00:05:12.673 language learning. 00:05:12.673 --> 00:05:14.533 That's the best I can do on that one. 00:05:14.533 --> 00:05:24.513 Okay, and that was interesting to hear because people interpret these terms very differently. 00:05:25.513 --> 00:05:31.093 And this is Carey's interpretation, and this is the way they're using it and seeing it. 00:05:31.793 --> 00:05:35.673 Now, the way they're looked at in the literature is a little bit different. 00:05:35.673 --> 00:05:41.713 So that total immersion is only 00:05:41.713 --> 00:05:43.513 total at the beginning. 00:05:43.513 --> 00:05:46.413 In total immersion programs in 00:05:46.413 --> 00:05:48.293 Canada, the United States, 00:05:48.284 --> 00:05:57.024 Australia and Europe, South America, a child would come into a kindergarten program or the 00:05:57.024 --> 00:06:04.944 first year of school and be totally immersed in the second language and might stay completely 00:06:04.944 --> 00:06:14.204 immersed in that for a year or two and in the second year of school begin to do some mother tongue. 00:06:15.024 --> 00:06:19.184 So let's say a language arts class in their first language. 00:06:20.064 --> 00:06:24.884 Then in grade three, a little bit more mother tongue. 00:06:25.664 --> 00:06:32.324 Grade four, a little bit more until let's say grade six when it's about 50-50. 00:06:33.044 --> 00:06:35.184 And then continuing 50-50. 00:06:35.844 --> 00:06:41.104 So in the literature, that's a total immersion program. 00:06:41.104 --> 00:06:44.764 but in fact it's not total, it's only total at the beginning. 00:06:46.224 --> 00:06:54.064 Now, a partial immersion program would start off by perhaps doing 50-50 from the beginning. 00:06:57.364 --> 00:07:01.544 50% through the mother tongue, 50% through the second language. 00:07:02.524 --> 00:07:07.904 Now, a two-way immersion program, two-way programs are used in several places, 00:07:07.904 --> 00:07:10.804 but primarily in the United States, 00:07:10.804 --> 00:07:15.344 where there are large groups of children coming from 00:07:15.355 --> 00:07:20.155 homes where children are speaking another language. 00:07:20.915 --> 00:07:23.875 That language could be Spanish. 00:07:24.075 --> 00:07:28.095 Most of these two-way immersion programs are Spanish-English. 00:07:28.675 --> 00:07:38.655 But it could also be Korean-English, Chinese-English, Portuguese-English. 00:07:38.655 --> 00:07:40.295 There are quite a few options. 00:07:40.295 --> 00:07:47.615 but basically the principle is that 50% of the children are from one language background, 00:07:48.235 --> 00:07:52.015 50% of the children are from another language background. 00:07:53.055 --> 00:07:57.455 Half of the day they spend studying subjects through one language, 00:07:58.055 --> 00:08:00.235 half of the day through the other. 00:08:01.275 --> 00:08:04.735 Half of the day the child from the immigrant background 00:08:04.735 --> 00:08:10.095 is actually feeling quite powerful because they have the stronger command 00:08:10.095 --> 00:08:12.195 of the language of instruction. 00:08:12.935 --> 00:08:16.095 And for half of the day, they don't. 00:08:16.735 --> 00:08:18.895 And then vice versa for the kids 00:08:18.895 --> 00:08:23.635 who are speaking the dominant language of society, 00:08:23.755 --> 00:08:24.675 in this case, English. 00:08:25.455 --> 00:08:27.575 It is a particularly good program 00:08:27.575 --> 00:08:29.795 because the kids learn to help each other 00:08:29.795 --> 00:08:32.215 to not only learn language, 00:08:32.215 --> 00:08:34.555 but they are interacting. 00:08:34.875 --> 00:08:36.775 They are becoming social agents, 00:08:37.115 --> 00:08:39.695 as we saw in that Council of Europe definition, 00:08:40.095 --> 00:08:42.435 They are... 00:08:42.426 --> 00:08:46.106 taking part in intercultural action. 00:08:46.806 --> 00:08:50.846 They're learning together, and they're very effective. 00:08:52.366 --> 00:08:57.426 And a double immersion program is meant for a society 00:08:57.426 --> 00:08:59.406 where there is a dominant language. 00:09:00.846 --> 00:09:03.426 And let's take the case of Montreal, 00:09:03.866 --> 00:09:05.986 where in an English-speaking neighborhood, 00:09:05.986 --> 00:09:09.886 despite the fact that Montreal is primarily French-speaking, 00:09:09.886 --> 00:09:17.586 there are Jewish schools, and some of these Jewish schools are set up in the following manner. 00:09:18.826 --> 00:09:27.886 Part of the day is conducted through Hebrew. Part of the day is conducted through French. 00:09:29.466 --> 00:09:33.566 Neither of those two languages are the children's first language. 00:09:34.306 --> 00:09:39.866 So the children come to school and are having to face two new languages. 00:09:39.886 --> 00:09:41.886 relationships. 00:09:41.886 --> 00:09:44.386 So if we think that double, if we 00:09:44.386 --> 00:09:46.886 think that immersion is a lot for a 00:09:46.886 --> 00:09:50.426 child to cope with, well, in 00:09:50.426 --> 00:09:51.926 Montreal they're doing double 00:09:51.926 --> 00:09:53.506 immersion. 00:09:53.506 --> 00:09:55.306 And people such as Fred Genesee 00:09:55.306 --> 00:09:57.306 have researched this thoroughly. 00:09:57.306 --> 00:09:58.846 Any further questions about the 00:09:58.846 --> 00:10:01.346 many faces? 00:10:01.346 --> 00:10:03.606 I may be jumping ahead, but in 00:10:03.606 --> 00:10:06.046 listening to your description, I 00:10:06.046 --> 00:10:08.046 see how it is being implemented at 00:10:08.046 --> 00:10:09.506 our school. 00:10:09.497 --> 00:10:17.697 that arises is, okay, if we have a partial immersion format for the secondary level, 00:10:18.717 --> 00:10:24.177 the teacher is a native speaker. We're in Indonesia as well. So they're a native Indonesian. 00:10:24.837 --> 00:10:30.537 They can speak Bahasa, but their preference is to teach the subject in their native language. 00:10:30.657 --> 00:10:35.877 They can speak English, but they prefer to teach it in Bahasa. The student's first language is 00:10:35.877 --> 00:10:42.877 Bahasa can speak English but prefers it in their native tongue. So now we teach the subject 00:10:42.877 --> 00:10:50.877 bilingually. The teacher does. The question is, the exam when it comes to Cambridge is 00:10:51.337 --> 00:10:58.337 always in English. The subject has been taught bilingually with a stronger reference to the 00:10:58.337 --> 00:11:03.897 a stronger reference to the native tongue, but then we come to the Cambridge exam. Will 00:11:03.897 --> 00:11:11.897 the Cambridge exam be bilingual as well? Never. 00:11:11.897 --> 00:11:13.897 Okay. Well, I— 00:11:13.897 --> 00:11:19.957 So that's one of the issues that we are facing in this bilingual education format. It's 00:11:19.957 --> 00:11:24.177 great and there's a lot of benefits for it, but then there comes a limitation to how far 00:11:24.177 --> 00:11:26.177 we can take it. 00:11:26.177 --> 00:11:34.717 Well, first of all, I'm not sure I'm qualified to answer the question as far as Cambridge 00:11:34.717 --> 00:11:36.557 and testing is concerned. 00:11:36.568 --> 00:11:46.508 However, what you're talking about is a format, a bilingual format that is used in some schools 00:11:46.508 --> 00:11:56.128 where inside of each class there is bilingual education going on, there is a switching of language going on. 00:11:56.128 --> 00:12:02.548 And, okay, all right. 00:12:02.548 --> 00:12:11.468 Now, those programs have been less well researched, and I know of no major systematic research 00:12:11.468 --> 00:12:12.728 study in that area. 00:12:13.628 --> 00:12:17.028 So, in that sense, I don't think I can comment on those. 00:12:18.228 --> 00:12:24.628 And one of the reasons why it's perhaps difficult to research those is because it's very hard 00:12:24.628 --> 00:12:25.528 to get a sense. 00:12:25.528 --> 00:12:33.408 one would have to invest a lot into making sure that you can compare various programs 00:12:33.408 --> 00:12:37.968 because each lesson and each classroom is going to be very dynamic and changing. 00:12:39.328 --> 00:12:44.048 So I think that one I can't respond to as far as the research is concerned. 00:12:45.288 --> 00:12:50.168 But, for instance, many of us at some point in life have to take tests in different languages. 00:12:50.168 --> 00:12:55.968 So those are issues that have to be weighed, thought through. 00:12:55.968 --> 00:12:58.548 People need to be prepared for them. 00:12:58.548 --> 00:13:03.648 So let's come to this term CLIL, Content and Language Integrated Learning. 00:13:03.639 --> 00:13:06.759 It is a dual-focused teaching and learning approach 00:13:06.759 --> 00:13:14.859 in which the L1 and additional language are used for promoting both content mastery 00:13:14.859 --> 00:13:18.419 and language acquisition to a predefined level. 00:13:19.639 --> 00:13:25.299 You need to be able to tell staff needs to know, students need to know 00:13:25.299 --> 00:13:28.459 what kind of language level is going to be achieved. 00:13:28.459 --> 00:13:33.839 and that takes quite some time and investment to figure out. 00:13:36.259 --> 00:13:44.659 Now, the program goals, whether it's CLIL or for any intensive, in a sense, bilingual program 00:13:44.659 --> 00:13:51.139 where you're going to be working for years, would be to ensure that the students become proficient 00:13:51.139 --> 00:13:54.299 in the L1 and the L2. 00:13:54.299 --> 00:14:02.479 And we know, for instance, that students in Canadian immersion programs achieve a level 00:14:02.479 --> 00:14:07.259 where they understand with native-like fluency. 00:14:07.959 --> 00:14:13.639 They can read with native-like fluency, but they cannot write or speak with native-like 00:14:13.639 --> 00:14:14.159 fluency. 00:14:14.619 --> 00:14:15.719 They'll make mistakes. 00:14:16.659 --> 00:14:19.659 They will use Anglicisms. 00:14:19.659 --> 00:14:24.659 They might use language 00:14:24.659 --> 00:14:26.499 sometimes inappropriately and so 00:14:26.499 --> 00:14:27.899 forth, but they're perfectly 00:14:27.899 --> 00:14:29.539 capable of communicating. 00:14:29.539 --> 00:14:30.719 They're perfectly capable of 00:14:30.710 --> 00:14:32.870 of functioning through the second language. 00:14:34.150 --> 00:14:36.930 So another one is that they would have an understanding 00:14:36.930 --> 00:14:39.050 and an appreciation of the two cultures, 00:14:40.050 --> 00:14:44.350 that they would have a habit of and an interest 00:14:44.350 --> 00:14:45.870 in intercultural dialogue, 00:14:46.270 --> 00:14:49.430 because we certainly wouldn't want to be developing bilingual programs 00:14:49.430 --> 00:14:52.050 where students learn to speak a language, 00:14:52.050 --> 00:14:55.590 but they only use it to speak to each other or to the teacher. 00:14:56.630 --> 00:14:59.830 I mean, ultimately, we would like to create opportunities 00:14:59.830 --> 00:15:02.530 for students to communicate with each other, 00:15:02.530 --> 00:15:04.950 which nowadays is more and more possible 00:15:04.950 --> 00:15:07.110 thanks to the technologies that we have. 00:15:08.790 --> 00:15:11.830 Be that as simple as an email project 00:15:11.830 --> 00:15:16.210 or communication through Skype with a classroom in Sweden 00:15:16.210 --> 00:15:20.410 and a classroom in Thailand, for example, 00:15:20.550 --> 00:15:21.650 which I've seen happen. 00:15:23.430 --> 00:15:25.590 Cognitive, and to make sure that the children 00:15:25.590 --> 00:15:27.450 have the cognitive and social skills 00:15:27.450 --> 00:15:29.550 and the habits required for success, 00:15:29.830 --> 00:15:35.030 So those are some of the goals, and those goals need to be actually declared, shared 00:15:35.030 --> 00:15:40.670 with parents and discussed, and their targets to be achieved. 00:15:40.670 --> 00:15:42.630 Can you take out the puzzle you've got? 00:15:42.630 --> 00:15:57.790 There's a puzzle there called the CLIL Essentials. 00:15:57.781 --> 00:16:06.181 And before I go into it, can you explore the puzzle with your group a little bit and if 00:16:06.181 --> 00:16:11.461 this summarizes many of the things that are important in content and language integrated 00:16:11.461 --> 00:16:18.341 learning or bilingual education, can you find some of the things on this puzzle that 00:16:18.341 --> 00:16:27.641 you do on a regular basis and share those with the people inside of your group? 00:16:27.641 --> 00:16:37.301 So tell me, does what's on this puzzle, content and language integrated learning puzzle, called 00:16:37.301 --> 00:16:40.801 the CLIL Essentials here, does it align with what you're doing? 00:16:41.601 --> 00:16:46.001 There was a lot of discussion at our table that is not my discussion to have. 00:16:46.421 --> 00:16:51.001 But most of it was that they agreed on much of what they saw. 00:16:51.001 --> 00:16:57.161 But the challenge was bringing that about within their own institution, to be able to 00:16:57.161 --> 00:17:00.001 do that in their own school. 00:17:00.001 --> 00:17:09.221 Mayor Paterson- Okay, and are those, the challenge is a pedagogical one, a management 00:17:09.221 --> 00:17:19.181 one, or a school culture issue, or would someone else at the table like to make a comment about 00:17:19.181 --> 00:17:20.581 about some of the challenges 00:17:20.581 --> 00:17:21.881 that you're facing, or? 00:17:24.281 --> 00:17:24.861 Because bilingual 00:17:24.852 --> 00:17:33.512 education actually puts a high demand on everyone. It's asking people to do more, in a sense, 00:17:33.652 --> 00:17:40.192 in less time. And interestingly enough, the research tells us it's possible and that you 00:17:40.192 --> 00:17:45.692 can actually get extra benefit from it. But it's not easy. And as I've gone around the 00:17:45.692 --> 00:17:51.732 world and had a chance to investigate these programs, because before we set them up in 00:17:51.732 --> 00:17:58.312 Estonia, we made a very thorough investigation, going off to several countries, learning about 00:17:58.312 --> 00:18:07.992 them, and teachers would always tell us the same things. This is a lot of work. This is a lot of 00:18:07.992 --> 00:18:14.172 work. And we finally heard it so many times, we started to say, well, how come you do it? 00:18:14.172 --> 00:18:19.772 And we were purely curious. 00:18:19.772 --> 00:18:23.672 We thought, you know, if it's so hard, why bother? 00:18:23.672 --> 00:18:28.272 And then they started to laugh and they said, well, actually, the reason we do it is because 00:18:28.272 --> 00:18:29.992 it works. 00:18:29.992 --> 00:18:32.212 Our students are more engaged. 00:18:32.212 --> 00:18:33.612 They're learning more. 00:18:33.612 --> 00:18:35.292 They're getting more language. 00:18:35.292 --> 00:18:37.872 I'm finding it more interesting. 00:18:37.872 --> 00:18:39.352 Would you go back to the other way? 00:18:39.352 --> 00:18:41.632 The answer was no. 00:18:41.632 --> 00:18:43.772 Now the question is management. 00:18:43.772 --> 00:18:45.172 We're going to spend, after the 00:18:45.172 --> 00:18:46.272 break, we're going to start 00:18:46.272 --> 00:18:47.712 looking at how schools can 00:18:47.712 --> 00:18:49.772 manage this. 00:18:49.772 --> 00:18:51.932 And one of the issues is that 00:18:51.922 --> 00:18:58.922 is trying to figure out how to provide staff with the support that's necessary, the time 00:18:58.922 --> 00:19:06.102 for some joint planning, et cetera. Because it is perhaps not the fairest thing to simply 00:19:06.102 --> 00:19:11.682 say, here you take all of this burden without providing extra resource. It should not be 00:19:11.682 --> 00:19:19.142 just the teacher's responsibility. But let's get back to this. What about the other tables? 00:19:19.142 --> 00:19:22.222 Does this align with your thinking? 00:19:22.222 --> 00:19:24.482 Is this what you're trying to do? 00:19:24.482 --> 00:19:28.382 My name's Jimmy, I'm from Indonesia. 00:19:28.382 --> 00:19:30.262 I feel honored to be here. 00:19:30.262 --> 00:19:35.262 Especially, I got a chance to talk to you because now I'm doing my thesis for my master's 00:19:35.262 --> 00:19:38.382 program about this thing, bilingualism. 00:19:38.382 --> 00:19:43.262 Well, let me share with you all about what's happening in our country, in my country, Indonesia. 00:19:43.262 --> 00:19:48.742 A little bit difficult in terms of management and pedagogy as well. 00:19:49.442 --> 00:19:55.622 Because, for example, in public schools, especially public schools and private schools, 00:19:56.622 --> 00:20:02.722 we have to follow the government's rules that all Indonesian students have to follow their national exam. 00:20:04.042 --> 00:20:06.122 Grade 6, grade 9, grade 12. 00:20:07.042 --> 00:20:11.082 At the same time, people start to open many international schools. 00:20:11.082 --> 00:20:13.922 I mean, with the international curriculum 00:20:13.922 --> 00:20:15.922 like Cambridge or IB. 00:20:15.922 --> 00:20:19.002 At the end of the day, the students have to cope with two exams. 00:20:18.993 --> 00:20:23.993 because national exam is compulsory. 00:20:24.693 --> 00:20:27.473 But some schools start to change the policy. 00:20:27.473 --> 00:20:30.073 Okay, you may take the option. 00:20:30.073 --> 00:20:33.333 National exam is a must, but then Cambridge is an option. 00:20:33.333 --> 00:20:35.453 If you want to go abroad to study, 00:20:35.453 --> 00:20:39.213 then you may sit for that, A-levels, IGCIC, whatever, 00:20:39.213 --> 00:20:41.273 and IB as well. 00:20:41.273 --> 00:20:44.153 The problem lies on the implementation 00:20:44.153 --> 00:20:46.693 in the classroom setting. 00:20:46.693 --> 00:20:52.733 The teachers have to teach, whether in Indonesian or in English, like the gentleman raised just now, 00:20:53.273 --> 00:20:55.493 and then how to cope with the students. 00:20:55.733 --> 00:21:00.713 They know that this is important to learn the CLIL, the subjects in English. 00:21:01.293 --> 00:21:04.753 But at the same time, they have to spend time also to prepare for the exam. 00:21:05.953 --> 00:21:09.773 My concern is how to deal with those issues. 00:21:09.773 --> 00:21:14.673 I mean, perhaps you have solutions for us or you have ideas how to cope with it. 00:21:14.673 --> 00:21:21.853 In one hand, we don't ignore the national requirements, but on the other hand, we have 00:21:21.853 --> 00:21:27.253 to give students with this kind of opportunities to have more exposure on English. 00:21:28.293 --> 00:21:32.573 And, of course, for those who sit in international schools with international curriculum, they 00:21:32.573 --> 00:21:35.553 have to prepare for the exams as well. 00:21:36.633 --> 00:21:42.413 And this year, the government is getting strict that they have... 00:21:42.413 --> 00:21:46.073 previously they said okay, you may not follow 00:21:46.064 --> 00:21:52.924 national exam, that's fine. But starting 2013, they have to. So no other excuse. You have to, 00:21:53.584 --> 00:21:59.064 whatever school you have, British international school, Canadian international school, Singapore 00:21:59.064 --> 00:22:04.344 international school, you have to follow the national exam. So that's my issue. Perhaps, 00:22:04.564 --> 00:22:09.944 I don't know, from the audience, I can have like solutions for that. Thank you. 00:22:09.944 --> 00:22:22.204 One of the concerns always is the examination, and one of the tendencies, unfortunately, when the examination is very high stakes is to teach to the exam. 00:22:23.284 --> 00:22:31.784 And there's a feeling often that you have to trot through the material, move through it quickly, make sure you cover it all. 00:22:32.904 --> 00:22:36.684 But actually, students don't learn a great deal that way. 00:22:36.684 --> 00:22:52.864 And really, that has much more to do with the teacher trying to make herself or himself feel comfortable, in a sense, to make sure that they've at least shown the student what they need to go off and almost learn by themselves. 00:22:52.864 --> 00:23:00.224 What we do know from the research, and these are people such as Stobart and others, is 00:23:00.224 --> 00:23:13.144 that the more that you focus on pedagogy and good quality teaching, the better the students 00:23:13.135 --> 00:23:14.935 on the high-stakes exams. 00:23:16.735 --> 00:23:22.375 Now, let's look at the four words simply we have up there. 00:23:22.535 --> 00:23:26.155 Even four things like that for a teacher to juggle, 00:23:26.375 --> 00:23:30.975 content, language, learning skills, and thinking skills, cognition. 00:23:31.575 --> 00:23:33.455 That's a lot to do. 00:23:34.675 --> 00:23:38.255 Now, let me just take an example from learning skills. 00:23:38.255 --> 00:23:45.355 We know, for instance, that if you take one group of students, 00:23:45.355 --> 00:23:49.075 Vienman did a study on this and others have looked at this, 00:23:50.075 --> 00:23:57.355 if you're looking at one group of students who have been scoring high on IQ tests 00:23:57.355 --> 00:24:02.395 and they have weak learning skills, 00:24:02.395 --> 00:24:12.235 and you have another group that has been scoring average on IQ tests but have good learning skills 00:24:12.235 --> 00:24:17.175 and you give both of those groups an easy problem, 00:24:17.815 --> 00:24:22.915 then those that have been scoring high on IQ tests will do better. 00:24:23.915 --> 00:24:26.895 But here's the important piece of news. 00:24:26.895 --> 00:24:38.675 If you give them a cognitively challenging problem, it is the ones with the learning skills that will do better. 00:24:40.206 --> 00:24:53.846 So learning skills are a more important determinant of how well students will do in a school in certain circumstances than IQ score. 00:24:54.746 --> 00:25:00.746 The first of IQ score is an iffy and dodgy thing on some level anyway, 00:25:00.746 --> 00:25:05.186 because anyone's capacity to think can be dramatically improved. 00:25:05.186 --> 00:25:12.046 because as we said before, or I said before, Doidge, Dweck, and others have said, the brain is plastic. 00:25:12.986 --> 00:25:19.386 It can physically change. We can actually improve our capacity to learn and think. 00:25:20.326 --> 00:25:22.786 It is good pedagogy that drives it. 00:25:22.786 --> 00:25:27.446 Let me give you one more example. There was Stevens, I think 1983. 00:25:27.446 --> 00:25:37.166 old study but an important one, looked at a late immersion program in Montreal where 00:25:37.166 --> 00:25:46.086 50% of all instruction was through French, which was a second language for the students, 00:25:46.086 --> 00:25:52.946 and in another school that was comparable in every other way, the similar type of neighborhood, 00:25:52.946 --> 00:25:54.446 So, they were both good, 00:25:54.446 --> 00:25:55.986 socioeconomically speaking, the 00:25:55.986 --> 00:25:58.126 same sort of groups. 00:25:58.126 --> 00:26:01.086 And the other group got 80% of 00:26:01.086 --> 00:26:02.186 their instruction through 00:26:02.186 --> 00:26:03.186 French. 00:26:03.186 --> 00:26:05.166 So, one group got 50% of their 00:26:05.166 --> 00:26:07.286 instruction through French, the 00:26:07.277 --> 00:26:14.857 80% of their instruction through French for a period of two years. And then they tested the 00:26:14.857 --> 00:26:23.797 students. And after two years, there was no statistically significant difference in the 00:26:23.797 --> 00:26:31.897 quality of the French being produced by either group of students. So one of the first reactions 00:26:31.897 --> 00:26:37.517 would be, well, maybe I've made a mistake with the data, if one is a researcher. But then they 00:26:37.517 --> 00:26:43.957 looked at what was happening in the classroom, and they found that in the classroom, where 80%, 00:26:44.697 --> 00:26:49.977 or with the group, where 80% was being delivered through the medium of French, 00:26:50.337 --> 00:26:56.477 that it was teacher-centered. The teacher was doing more of the talking, the teacher was making 00:26:56.477 --> 00:27:05.317 the decisions. Whereas in the group that was working only 50% of the time through French, 00:27:06.577 --> 00:27:14.657 the students were able to make some of their own choices. The students were able to pick from 00:27:14.657 --> 00:27:21.877 among various activities. There were clear outcomes that they were to achieve and so forth. 00:27:21.877 --> 00:27:23.217 with. 00:27:23.217 --> 00:27:24.677 They had more contact and 00:27:24.677 --> 00:27:27.377 communication with speakers of 00:27:27.377 --> 00:27:28.817 that language. 00:27:28.817 --> 00:27:30.117 They had more control. 00:27:30.117 --> 00:27:31.917 It was a more meaningful learning 00:27:31.917 --> 00:27:32.657 environment. 00:27:32.657 --> 00:27:34.357 It was a student-centered 00:27:34.348 --> 00:27:40.628 learning environment. They did more group work and pair work, and they did it well. 00:27:42.228 --> 00:27:48.508 There are numerous situations where we know that pedagogy makes a huge difference. 00:27:49.308 --> 00:27:54.868 If you've never come across a book by Hattie, I just saw you had the list there. 00:27:54.868 --> 00:28:05.088 There is a man named Hattie who has summarized 900 meta-studies in education. 00:28:06.168 --> 00:28:10.888 That is a tremendous number of studies in education. 00:28:11.488 --> 00:28:13.948 One meta-study looks at many, many studies. 00:28:15.228 --> 00:28:21.068 And they've been able to quantify the effect of various teaching strategies. 00:28:21.068 --> 00:28:27.008 Hattie, that's H-A-T-T-I-E, 2012. 00:28:28.268 --> 00:28:31.688 This is a source that I think is worth taking a look at 00:28:31.688 --> 00:28:38.408 because it tells us that we know from this research, 00:28:38.468 --> 00:28:42.348 which has been conducted, this is a synthesis, 00:28:42.908 --> 00:28:46.108 an analysis of research done across the globe 00:28:46.108 --> 00:28:48.668 over years and years and years. 00:28:48.668 --> 00:28:54.668 So in various languages, cultures, and the same results are being found. 00:28:54.668 --> 00:29:01.428 That certain things are more powerful than other things. So learning skills are 00:29:01.419 --> 00:29:04.339 particularly important. 00:29:04.339 --> 00:29:08.659 Giving students a greater degree of autonomy. 00:29:08.659 --> 00:29:11.179 Letting them make decisions. 00:29:11.179 --> 00:29:12.959 Having students, for instance, 00:29:14.919 --> 00:29:18.879 suggest, let's say, have them write a composition. 00:29:18.879 --> 00:29:21.979 Why simply have them write the composition, 00:29:21.979 --> 00:29:23.819 hand it in and get it marked? 00:29:23.819 --> 00:29:27.339 Why not first agree with them on the criteria? 00:29:27.339 --> 00:29:30.699 Then hand in a draft to you, 00:29:30.699 --> 00:29:35.699 not just with the draft, but with the mark 00:29:37.039 --> 00:29:39.919 that they would give themselves for the draft, 00:29:39.919 --> 00:29:44.919 and with a quarter page or a half page explanation 00:29:44.919 --> 00:29:47.659 of why they deserve that mark. 00:29:47.659 --> 00:29:49.919 Make them lobby for it. 00:29:49.919 --> 00:29:52.779 Then provide them feedback on that. 00:29:52.779 --> 00:29:57.839 Students are far more likely to uptake, 00:29:57.839 --> 00:30:04.839 to accept feedback in the middle of a process than they are after they get their mark. 00:30:04.839 --> 00:30:10.839 After you get a mark, once you see the mark, everything else flies out of your head. 00:30:10.839 --> 00:30:11.839 You remember the mark. 00:30:11.839 --> 00:30:14.839 A lot of the feedback doesn't stick. 00:30:14.839 --> 00:30:21.839 Whereas we know from research again that when that feedback is given during the process, 00:30:21.839 --> 00:30:25.839 students are more likely to incorporate it. 00:30:25.839 --> 00:30:28.499 So there are many things about good pedigree 00:30:28.490 --> 00:30:30.990 that I think we need to know about. 00:30:31.870 --> 00:30:36.470 So if we're doing something as challenging as bilingual education, 00:30:36.970 --> 00:30:43.190 I think we have a kind of a moral obligation to be the best educators we can be 00:30:43.190 --> 00:30:47.750 and to take a look at what some of this research is saying. 00:30:49.110 --> 00:30:54.990 So some of these things, and these are some of the things that are actually coming out on this sheet, 00:30:54.990 --> 00:30:56.250 which is CLIL essentials. 00:30:58.490 --> 00:31:19.930 Dialogic teaching. Let me take this example. How many of you operate with the term dialogic teaching? One, two? Okay. Perhaps this is also a term that is worth investigating and applying in a bilingual education context in particular. 00:31:19.930 --> 00:31:23.230 So it's dialogic teaching. 00:31:24.030 --> 00:31:28.830 And I think if you Google it, you're going to find information on it. 00:31:28.890 --> 00:31:32.510 You'll find various books that have been written on it that you'll find useful. 00:31:33.450 --> 00:31:38.510 But let's take a few minutes to just get a taste of dialogic teaching. 00:31:42.530 --> 00:31:45.290 What if I, I mean, I have a glass there. 00:31:45.290 --> 00:31:55.570 It's, and, well, if I was, if you were the class and I was the teacher, 00:31:55.561 --> 00:32:01.861 I would first just say, what do you think is some of the language we're going to need 00:32:01.861 --> 00:32:04.501 to be doing whatever we're going to be doing? 00:32:04.681 --> 00:32:06.621 Just looking at what's on the table there. 00:32:07.761 --> 00:32:09.901 What would you say would be some of that language? 00:32:15.201 --> 00:32:17.661 What might we need as far as language is concerned? 00:32:17.801 --> 00:32:19.061 Let's just brainstorm it. 00:32:19.641 --> 00:32:20.741 Brainstorm in your group. 00:32:21.041 --> 00:32:23.581 Come up with just some language that might be needed. 00:32:23.581 --> 00:32:29.521 it. You don't even know what we're going to do with it, try and guess. What's some of 00:32:29.521 --> 00:32:36.521 the language you might need? All right, let's hear what some of that might be. So what's 00:32:36.521 --> 00:32:46.521 some of that language? What words, expressions, phrases might be necessary to even begin to 00:32:46.521 --> 00:32:55.961 work with this. Right? Okay, volume, shape, color. And you would literally try and brainstorm 00:32:55.961 --> 00:33:01.501 with the students, and you'd start putting some of this language up. That is scaffolding. 00:33:01.641 --> 00:33:07.781 That is support. You're bringing the language, you're making it visible. What other language 00:33:07.781 --> 00:33:08.701 what might you need? 00:33:10.201 --> 00:33:11.141 Question words? 00:33:15.001 --> 00:33:17.441 Well, so start giving me some of the phrases. 00:33:19.941 --> 00:33:22.341 What are the uses? 00:33:22.632 --> 00:33:26.532 Okay, so let's, what are some of the uses of these things? 00:33:26.532 --> 00:33:28.732 How are we going to use these? 00:33:28.732 --> 00:33:30.732 How do you think we're going to use them? 00:33:30.732 --> 00:33:37.672 Well, wait and we'll see in a moment. 00:33:37.672 --> 00:33:42.672 Any other language? 00:33:42.672 --> 00:33:44.672 Okay. 00:33:44.672 --> 00:33:50.672 What else? 00:33:50.672 --> 00:33:57.672 You might need phrases. 00:33:57.672 --> 00:34:00.672 You might start looking at it. 00:34:00.672 --> 00:34:05.672 I mean, one of the options is, and what we are actually going to do is we're going to 00:34:05.672 --> 00:34:09.672 start placing the paper clips in the glass. 00:34:09.672 --> 00:34:18.672 And you might, students might come up with language such as water overflowing, et cetera. 00:34:18.672 --> 00:34:24.172 etc. So you get much of this language up on the board. And then, and I'm going to ask you to do 00:34:24.172 --> 00:34:33.832 it now, write down how many paper clips you think will fit into that glass before the water starts 00:34:33.832 --> 00:34:44.432 to spill out, before a drop of water exits that glass. Can you write that on a piece? Just write 00:34:44.432 --> 00:34:45.632 So I'm going to write it down 00:34:45.632 --> 00:34:46.732 right now without discussing it 00:34:46.732 --> 00:34:47.972 with anyone. 00:34:47.972 --> 00:34:49.712 Just write it down. 00:34:49.703 --> 00:35:01.883 discuss it with anyone, do it first alone. Just a number. Two, five, ten, how many? Have 00:35:01.883 --> 00:35:04.883 you got a number down? Because you're going to have to show it to someone. 00:35:19.703 --> 00:35:23.223 Okay, so that's an important question. 00:35:23.843 --> 00:35:26.743 It's not, it looks like it's not completely full. 00:35:27.383 --> 00:35:30.623 I'm obviously not seeing as clearly as I hoped. 00:35:30.903 --> 00:35:35.383 Yeah, yeah, you could probably squeeze a few more drops of water in there. 00:35:35.563 --> 00:35:36.623 Certainly not a lot. 00:35:36.883 --> 00:35:39.123 I did my best to fill it, but it's true. 00:35:39.263 --> 00:35:40.963 You could probably get a half a mil. 00:35:41.423 --> 00:35:42.703 Really, just a... 00:35:42.703 --> 00:35:55.143 But so, now turn to the person next to you and show them what your figure is and tell them why you think it is that number. 00:35:58.143 --> 00:35:59.783 All right, I'm going to stop you there. 00:36:03.303 --> 00:36:12.183 So, what did the person you talked to tell you as far as a number is concerned and what was their explanation of why? 00:36:12.703 --> 00:36:16.783 He talks about it's because the paper clip is not solid enough. 00:36:16.774 --> 00:36:29.774 Okay. So the 50 will fit in there and no, you disagree? What do you... 00:36:29.774 --> 00:36:31.774 Ten. 00:36:31.774 --> 00:36:34.774 Okay, and why do you think about ten? 00:36:34.774 --> 00:36:39.554 Female Speaker 2, the volume of the paper clip into consideration and the glass is only 00:36:39.554 --> 00:36:40.554 what about that? 00:36:40.554 --> 00:36:44.734 And there's only half a mil of water left at the top and so your average paper clip 00:36:44.734 --> 00:36:47.154 is what about just over a mil thick? 00:36:47.154 --> 00:36:49.154 And yeah, about 10. 00:36:49.154 --> 00:36:58.134 Speaker 2, so you think the volume of the paper clips will be displacing the water. 00:36:58.134 --> 00:36:59.134 Okay. 00:36:59.134 --> 00:37:01.134 What about that table? 00:37:01.134 --> 00:37:09.134 We felt that we needed more information and we're... 00:37:09.134 --> 00:37:12.034 As I'm sure you did. 00:37:12.454 --> 00:37:16.514 And the information that it wasn't quite full caused a little bit of a delay. 00:37:17.194 --> 00:37:17.494 Okay. 00:37:18.214 --> 00:37:20.334 But now you have a little more information. 00:37:22.274 --> 00:37:25.134 And you could certainly, if we were working in a classroom, 00:37:25.714 --> 00:37:28.194 you could come up and have students take a look at it. 00:37:28.194 --> 00:37:30.094 The other thing is, if we were 00:37:30.094 --> 00:37:31.694 working in a classroom, I would 00:37:31.694 --> 00:37:33.594 beginning to get all of these 00:37:33.594 --> 00:37:36.534 theories up onto the board. 00:37:36.534 --> 00:37:38.834 Or I'd be typing them up and 00:37:38.834 --> 00:37:40.414 getting them up onto the screen. 00:37:40.414 --> 00:37:41.814 Or actually, I'd be having a 00:37:41.814 --> 00:37:43.774 student help me do that. 00:37:43.845 --> 00:37:47.385 or two students helping me to do that. 00:37:48.525 --> 00:37:51.485 But let's hear about what some of those other numbers are. 00:37:54.225 --> 00:37:56.065 Or Kiergy's friend. 00:37:56.065 --> 00:37:57.385 Okay, here. 00:37:59.225 --> 00:38:04.225 30 pieces because when we put like five or 10, 00:38:04.565 --> 00:38:07.005 it will only float on the top. 00:38:07.005 --> 00:38:10.265 And if you put more, then they will go down. 00:38:10.265 --> 00:38:12.465 It means the water will come. 00:38:13.845 --> 00:38:17.845 So it's possible that some of these are going to float. 00:38:17.845 --> 00:38:20.845 Could I have somebody, could you come up on the stage? 00:38:20.845 --> 00:38:23.845 You have to be putting them in the centre. 00:38:23.845 --> 00:38:28.845 So one of the possibilities is that some of them are going to float. 00:38:28.845 --> 00:38:30.845 So can you see what happens? 00:38:32.845 --> 00:38:33.845 Yeah. 00:38:35.845 --> 00:38:38.845 Okay, now when you put them in like that, didn't float. 00:38:38.845 --> 00:38:42.845 But how many did you say you thought would fit in? 00:38:42.845 --> 00:38:44.105 30. 00:38:44.105 --> 00:38:44.985 30. 00:38:44.985 --> 00:38:46.185 Go ahead, put in 30. 00:38:51.185 --> 00:38:57.185 20, 21, 22, 23, 24. 00:39:07.605 --> 00:39:08.845 OK, well, we know that they 00:39:08.845 --> 00:39:10.925 don't float. 00:39:10.916 --> 00:39:16.576 them in that way, so we've learned that. Could we have everyone write a new number down, a new 00:39:16.576 --> 00:39:21.856 estimate, without discussing it with anyone else? What numbers did you come up with around your 00:39:21.856 --> 00:39:27.316 table, and what was the explanation of why? We have several explanations going. We've been talking 00:39:27.316 --> 00:39:32.376 about volume, okay? We've talked about the mass. 00:39:35.316 --> 00:39:37.416 All right, my number is 500. 00:39:37.416 --> 00:39:43.276 All right. And can you give me an explain why? 00:39:43.276 --> 00:39:45.376 Well, first of all, I'm a physicist. 00:39:46.716 --> 00:39:50.276 So I give a physics explanation for it. 00:39:51.516 --> 00:39:55.836 The paper clip is really small in terms of volumes and mass. 00:39:56.476 --> 00:40:02.116 And in fact, the water level may be higher than the rim of the cup before it's spilled out. 00:40:02.456 --> 00:40:06.736 So if you keep rubbing it in, then the water level keeps raising up. 00:40:06.736 --> 00:40:11.176 And it doesn't mean that when it relates to the rim of the class, we spill out. 00:40:11.396 --> 00:40:15.416 No, it keeps going a little bit higher than the rim before spilling out. 00:40:15.916 --> 00:40:21.096 So I guess some hundreds of the paper clip can do this. 00:40:21.116 --> 00:40:24.076 Okay, so you think that we could figure it out. 00:40:24.096 --> 00:40:25.896 All right, let's try the whole box. 00:40:26.696 --> 00:40:30.056 Okay, you think one box, four boxes, five boxes? 00:40:30.076 --> 00:40:31.456 How many clips are in one box? 00:40:32.576 --> 00:40:33.156 A hundred. 00:40:33.156 --> 00:40:34.036 A hundred? 00:40:34.836 --> 00:40:36.636 So let's try three boxes. 00:40:36.736 --> 00:40:37.996 three boxes. 00:40:37.987 --> 00:40:40.487 Okay, so he thinks it's three boxes. 00:40:41.247 --> 00:40:46.067 He also thinks that the water is not going to spill out immediately. 00:40:46.767 --> 00:40:51.507 He says that the water can develop a kind of a curve. 00:40:52.927 --> 00:40:53.227 Okay. 00:40:55.427 --> 00:40:57.147 What are some other thoughts? 00:40:58.027 --> 00:41:02.867 My colleagues on this table, though, who say they might have seen this trick once before, 00:41:03.547 --> 00:41:05.967 have increased their estimates to 200. 00:41:05.967 --> 00:41:07.447 And what have you got, David? 00:41:07.987 --> 00:41:09.107 127. 00:41:09.947 --> 00:41:17.127 So you're using psychological reasoning as opposed to scientific reasoning. 00:41:17.127 --> 00:41:20.787 You're figuring that I've got some kind of a trick up my sleeve. 00:41:21.287 --> 00:41:22.567 Kerry says she's with a physicist. 00:41:23.347 --> 00:41:23.667 Okay. 00:41:24.667 --> 00:41:27.267 So a physicist is going to help us out. 00:41:27.807 --> 00:41:35.647 Now, normally in the classroom, what's going to happen is that you would continue to try and get out all of these theories. 00:41:35.647 --> 00:41:41.647 theories, and you would begin to get all of the theories onto the board. 00:41:41.647 --> 00:41:47.087 In a sense, that is dialogic teaching, because I could walk out here and tell you how it 00:41:47.087 --> 00:41:52.687 works, but instead one is trying to get it from the student. 00:41:52.687 --> 00:41:59.487 And despite the fact that it takes time, it is apparently a far more effective way of 00:41:59.487 --> 00:42:05.067 teaching than telling the student the way it is. 00:42:05.058 --> 00:42:12.318 them discover it, having them explore their own understandings, having them sort out their 00:42:12.318 --> 00:42:13.618 thought processes. 00:42:14.078 --> 00:42:16.658 That is what dialogic teaching is about. 00:42:16.658 --> 00:42:23.658 Now, in fact, here we had 100, so... 00:42:23.658 --> 00:42:31.658 Let's see. 00:42:31.658 --> 00:42:36.658 We can, can you give me a hand, Ben? 00:42:36.658 --> 00:42:39.658 Here, Ben, let's see how many we can put in. 00:42:39.658 --> 00:42:44.658 Okay, well, anyway, we got about half the glass. 00:42:45.358 --> 00:42:47.898 Very often you can actually fill an entire glass. 00:42:48.518 --> 00:42:50.618 You can certainly do three quarters of a glass. 00:42:51.138 --> 00:42:52.858 And our physicists had the explanation 00:42:52.858 --> 00:42:54.798 it's surface tension is the issue. 00:42:55.658 --> 00:42:59.418 And the molecules reorganize themselves basically 00:42:59.418 --> 00:43:00.918 and there's surface tension, right? 00:43:01.558 --> 00:43:03.278 And the water is curved. 00:43:04.078 --> 00:43:06.898 That is an example simply of dialogic teaching. 00:43:07.358 --> 00:43:08.638 We didn't have boards. 00:43:08.798 --> 00:43:10.478 We didn't take the time to do it. 00:43:10.478 --> 00:43:14.238 But any of that, taking that kind of an approach 00:43:14.238 --> 00:43:16.698 is going to be far more effective than actually teaching.